That's one of the dangers of dei-fication, Gloria in excelsis Emeagwali, (and I do hope that you realise that the tail end of your surname "Wali"– in Arabic, means "Friend "Saint" ...as in Wali-ullah (friend / saint of Allah). Better it is to be a friend of what's good and an enemy of what's evil....
You know that Madiba never minced his words – at his trial he said, "I am prepared to die" and when some toubabs objected to his visiting Colonel Gaddafi, his friend and anti-Apartheid supporter he retorted, "Those who feel irritated by our friendship with brother leader Gaddafi can go jump in the pool!"
I guess that if any of us had been unjustly imprisoned for 27 years by the Apartheid regime, we would be bitter, to say the least and be talking like Madiba about anything that even remotely smelled of Apartheid....
But we should be careful with the deification of anybody. With the deification of Jesus for example everything that he is reported to have said is regarded as God –in-the-flesh, speaking - something of the nature of Krishna as an incarnation of Vishnu, to my understanding more a Hindu than a Judaic tradition - so naturally the Hindus are really scared of Christian missionaries taking over their country – John's idea of "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" and that "The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us" could win many Hindu hearts and souls so easily, the cultural trappings could come later – that's probably why the "unbelieving Thomas " travelled all the way to Kerala and without much difficulty established what is now one of the world's oldest Christian communities there)
Madiba was/ is a great man – but not infallibly great, certainly not to be classed in the category of the 14 Infallibles in matters of religion, and any fallible human being is subject to the error of perception/ judgment. Madiba himself said, "I am not a saint, unless you think of a saint as a sinner who keeps on trying."
Here's another take which covers the same area that Giulio Meotti wrote about: Robert K. Lifton's article Nelson Mandela and the Israel-Palestinian Conflict
The bottom line:
"For our part we were able to express to Mandela and his aides the meaning of Zionism as the national liberation of the Jewish people through the founding and continued existence of a homeland. Had that homeland existed in the Nazi era, there would have been no Holocaust. This is why identifying Zionism as Racism, as then existed in UN Resolution 3379 (later expunged) is so odious to all Jews."
Some of Madiba's more extreme comments on the Israel-Palestinian issue, perhaps a little unfairly, remind me about that episode of infamy known in both Jewish and Islamic history as Khyber/ The Massacre at Khyber– and this is what is reported to have happened – please take in the whole situation)
After the Muslims had rounded up the Jews who they had defeated at Khyber, the Prophet of Islam (S.a.w.) then asked one of his companions Sa'd bin Mu'adh who had just suffered grievous bodily harm at the hands of his Jewish adversaries, in the just concluded war, "What shall we do with these Jews?"
Still in pain the companion said"all the able-bodied (adult) male persons belonging to the tribe should be killed, women and children taken prisoners and their wealth divided among the Muslim fighters!"
The prophet of Islam then replied to his companion's suggestion: "Verily, this judgement is from Heaven!"
The judgement was executed - it was a bloodbath, this slaughtering defenseless and innocent Jews, over 600 Jewish men were lined up and beheaded at the market square, acting on orders from Islam's last prophet.
He who feels it knows. Anyone who has been oppressed by Apartheid will tend to judge those whom he feels are Apartheid-like oppressors, harshly.
The other story is about a taxi driver whose attention was diverted for a split second and thus accidentally drove his car into the market stalls scattering everything in his way. When the Police arrived, the driver called as his witness a man who had seen it all happen He told the Police, "Just ask that leper over there what happened"
The "leper" told the police what he witnessed, he said, "I saw this crazy taxi driver, coming at 100 miles an hour, no brakes, no horn, so he just fkkked the whole place up!"
"What!" exclaimed the Taxi driver in disbelief...
"Is my name, Mr. Leper?" asked the angry leper...
As Chief Aluko usually says, "And there you have it!"
Sincerely,
On Sunday, 22 December 2013 14:56:55 UTC+1, Emeagwali, Gloria (History) wrote:
< In 1990, Mandela likened Israel to a "terrorist state" and declared that "we do not regard the PLO as a terrorist organization.
If one has to refer to any parties as a terrorist state, one might refer to the Israeli government because they are the people
who are slaughtering defenseless and innocent Arabs in the occupied territories".>
Quite a powerful statement by Madiba.
Professor Gloria Emeagwali
africahistory.net
vimeo.com/user5946750/videos
Documentaries on Africa and the African Diaspora
________________________________
From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com [usaafric...@googlegroups.com ] On Behalf Of Cornelius Hamelberg [cornelius...@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 22, 2013 8:06 AM
To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Mandela on Israel
Madiba Nelson Mandela did from time to time make statements that were strongly supportive of the Palestinian cause but this opinion piece by Giulio Meotti<https://www.google.se/search?sourceid=navclient&aq= > takes the biscuit:hts&oq=&ie=UTF-8&rlz=1T4NDKB_ enSE548SE548&q=Giulio+Meotti
Op-Ed: Mandela Was an Enemy of Israel<http://www.israelnationalnews.com/ >Articles/Article.aspx/14199
On Saturday, 14 December 2013 23:27:56 UTC+1, seguno2013 wrote:
Thanks for this information. No wonder the Israeli president or Prime Minister did not attend the memorial service of Madiba.
Segun Ogungbemi
Sent from my iPhone
On Dec 14, 2013, at 10:18 PM, "Abegunrin, Olayiwola M."<oabegunrin@Howard.edu> wrote:
>
> Get it straight, it was President Carter's book titled- "Palestine Peace not Apartheid," published in 2006. President Jimmy Carter prescribes steps that must be taken for the two States, Israeli and Palestine side by side to share "the Holy Land," without a system of apartheid or the constant fear of terrorism.
> Mandela's Party-African National Congress (ANC) was a very close ally of Palestinians during the struggle for the liberation of South Africa from the apartheid rule, while the Israeli Government was a close ally of the apartheid government in South Africa and even helped the apartheid government in developing nuclear weapon. South Africa under the apartheid rule was the only African country that developed nuclear weapon and it was with the help of the Israeli Government in the 1970s. The South African nuclear weapon was destroyed in 1992, during the negotiations between the White apartheid government and the ANC that led to black majority rule that elected Nelson Mandela as the first democratically elected President of South Africa in 1994. Go and read "The Unspoken Alliance: Israel's Secret Relationship With Apartheid South Africa," by Sasha Polakow-Suransky, published in 2010.
> Layi
>
>
>
> ________________________________________
> From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com<https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ > [usaafric...@googlegroups.com<UrlBlockedError.aspx https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >] On Behalf Of Emeagwali, Gloria (History) [emea...@mail.ccsu.edu<https:/UrlBlockedError.aspx /webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >]UrlBlockedError.aspx
> Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2013 12:57 PM
> To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com<https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >UrlBlockedError.aspx
> Cc: Wanazuoni; Chambi Chachage
> Subject: RE: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Mandela on Israel
>
> For your information, I recall that President Jimmy Carter called Israel an apartheid state .
> Does his statement hurt or help your story line?Add a link to his book, all the same.
>
>
> Professor Gloria Emeagwali
> vimeo.com/user5946750/videos<http://vimeo.com/user5946750/ >videos
> Documentaries on Africa and the African Diaspora
> ________________________________________
> From: usaafric...@googlegroups.com<https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ > [usaafric...@googlegroups.com<UrlBlockedError.aspx https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >] On Behalf Of Cornelius Hamelberg [cornelius...@gmail.com<https:UrlBlockedError.aspx //webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >]UrlBlockedError.aspx
> Sent: Saturday, December 14, 2013 8:46 AM
> To: usaafric...@googlegroups.com<https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >UrlBlockedError.aspx
> Cc: Wanazuoni; Chambi Chachage
> Subject: USA Africa Dialogue Series - Re: Mandela on Israel
>
> As has been admitted by the real author of the hoax – a Palestinian - that letter was not written by Madiba Nelson Mandela – and we all know that Madiba never equated and would never equate Israel with "an apartheid system" or what was Apartheid South Africa.
>
> We also know that on many occasions Madiba issued statements that were strongly supportive of the Palestinian cause.
>
> Just as Israel too was anxious for the Nigeria- Biafra Civil War to be speedily ended.<https://www.google.se/search?rlz=1T4NDKB_ >enSE548SE548&q=Israel+on+the+ Nigeria-Biafra+Civil+War&oq= Israel+on+the+Nigeria-Biafra+ Civil+War&gs_l=serp.12...5852. 5852.0.7541.1.1.0.0.0.0.29.29. 1.1.0.ernk_timepromotiona...0. ..1.1.32.serp..1.0.0.-TSog_ IeF5Q
>
> However let's be clear about this:
>
> Israel is not an apartheid state – Lecture by Denis Prager<http://www.israpundit.com/archives/53525 >
>
> Not Apartheid<http://www.israpundit.com/archives/4080 >
>
> Israel and the Apartheid Slander by Richard J. Goldstone<http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/01/opinion/israel- >and-the-apartheid-slander. html?_r=3&
>
> The myth of 'apartheid' Israel<http://www.israpundit.com/archives/3988 >
>
> Is Israel an Apartheid State?<http://www.israpundit.com/archives/31437 >
>
> I rest my case and N. B. if Israel were an Apartheid state – God forbid - I would have joined Hamas or Islamic Jihad and would be fighting on the side of the Pals, tooth and nail not to erect the 23rd Arab state in the area or a Sharia state called the Islamic Republic of Palestine in which non-Muslims would be dhimmis<https://www.google.se/search?sourceid=navclient&ie= > – I would be fighting to help dismantle such an Apartheid State...UTF-8&rlz=1T4NDKB_ enSE548SE548&q=dhimmis
>
> Sincerely,
>
> We Sweden<http://www.thelocal.se/blogs/corneliushamelberg/ >
>
>
> On Friday, 13 December 2013 15:06:59 UTC+1, Chambi Chachage wrote:
> ----- Forwarded Message -----
> From:
> To: cham...@yahoo.com<javascript:>
> Sent: Thursday, December 12, 2013 11:55 AM
> Subject: FW: Mandela had a moral compass; no double standards:
>
> Some shining messages from Mandela for the Israelis.
> Most of whom are living in a spécial bunker of their own.
>
> ________________________________
> Subject: Fwd: Mandela had a moral compass; no double standards:
> From: nahla....@hotmail.com<javascript:>
> Date: Thu, 12 Dec 2013 07:43:59 +0100
> To: ad...@arabooks.ch<javascript:>
> A must read.
>
> Begin forwarded message:
>
> From: Qazi Shaukat Fareed <far...@un.org<https://webmail.ccsu.edu/owa/ >>UrlBlockedError.aspx
> Date: 12 décembre 2013 02:54:03 HNEC
> Subject: Mandela had a moral compass; no double standards:
>
> Subject: Mandela had a moral compass; no double standards:
>
> please circulate..
>
> Mandela had a moral compass; no double standards : God bless his soul
>
> Nelson Mandela's Letter To Tom Friedman, About The Palestinian Tragedy
>
> MEMO
> March 28, 2001
>
> To: Thomas L. Friedman (columnist New York Times)
> From: Nelson Mandela (former President South Africa)
>
> Dear Thomas,
>
> I know that you and I long for peace in the Middle East, but before you continue to talk about necessary conditions from an Israeli perspective, you need to know what's on my mind. Where to begin? How about 1964. Let me quote my own words during my trial.
>
> They are true today as they were then:
> "I have fought against white domination and I have fought against black domination. I have cherished the ideal of a democratic and free society in which all persons live together in harmony and with equal opportunities. It is an ideal which I hope to live for and to achieve. But if needs be, it is an ideal for which I am prepared to die."
>
> Today the world, black and white, recognise that apartheid has no future. In South Africa it has been ended by our own decisive mass action in order to build peace and security. That mass campaign of defiance and other
> actions could only culminate in the establishment of democracy. Perhaps it is strange for you to observe the situation in Palestine or more specifically, the structure of political and cultural relationships between Palestinians and Israelis, as an apartheid system. This is because you incorrectly think that the problem of Palestine began in 1967.
> This was demonstrated in your recent column "Bush's First Memo" in the New York Times on March 27, 2001.
> You seem to be surprised to hear that there are still problems of 1948 to be solved, the most important component of which is the right to return of Palestinian refugees.
>
> The Palestinian-Israeli conflict is not just an issue of military occupation and Israel is not a country that was established "normally" and happened to occupy another country in 1967. Palestinians are not struggling for a "state" but for freedom, liberation and equality, just like we were struggling for freedom in South Africa.
>
> In the last few years, and especially during the reign of the Labour Party, Israel showed that it was not even willing to return what it occupied in 1967; that settlements remain, Jerusalem would be under exclusive Israeli sovereignty, and Palestinians would not have an independent state, but would be under Israeli economic domination with
> Israeli control of borders, land, air, water and sea.
>
> Israel was not thinking of a "state" but of "separation". The value of separation is measured in terms of the ability of Israel to keep the Jewish state Jewish, and not to have a Palestinian minority that could have the opportunity to become a majority at some time in the future. If this takes place, it would force Israel to either become a secular democratic or bi-national state, or to turn into a state of apartheid not only de facto, but also de jure.
>
> Thomas, if you follow the polls in Israel for the last 30 or 40 years, you clearly find a vulgar racism that includes a third of the population who openly declare themselves to be racist. This racism is of the nature of "I hate Arabs" and "I wish Arabs would be dead". If you also follow the judicial system in Israel you will see there is discrimination against Palestinians, and if you further consider the 1967 occupied territories you will find there are already two judicial systems in operation that represent two different approaches to human life: one for Palestinian life and the other for Jewish life. Additionally there are two different approaches to property and to land. Palestinian property is
> not recognised as private property because it can be confiscated.
>
> As to the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza, there is an additional factor. The so-called "Palestinian autonomous areas" are bantustans. These are restricted entities within the power structure of the Israeli apartheid system.
>
> The Palestinian state cannot be the by-product of the Jewish state, just in order to keep the Jewish purity of Israel. Israel's racial discrimination is daily life of most Palestinians. Since Israel is a Jewish state, Israeli Jews are able to accrue special rights which non-Jews cannot do. Palestinian Arabs have no place in a "Jewish" state.
>
> Apartheid is a crime against humanity. Israel has deprived millions of Palestinians of their liberty and property. It has perpetuated a system of gross racial discrimination and inequality. It has systematically incarcerated and tortured thousands of Palestinians, contrary to the rules of international law. It has, in particular, waged a war against a civilian population, in particular children.
>
> The responses made by South Africa to human rights abuses emanating from the removal policies and apartheid policies respectively, shed light on what Israeli society must necessarily go through before one can speak of a just and lasting peace in the Middle East and an end to its apartheid policies.
>
> Thomas, I'm not abandoning Mideast diplomacy. But I'm not going to indulge you the way your supporters do. If you want peace and democracy, I will support you. If you want formal apartheid, we will not support you. If you want to support racial discrimination and ethnic cleansing, we will oppose you. When you figure out what you're about, give me a call.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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